Taxes & Spending

Forbes Predicts U.S. Gold Standard Within 5 Years

A return to the gold standard by the United States within the next five years now seems likely, because that move would help the nation solve a variety of economic, fiscal, and monetary ills, Steve Forbes predicted during an exclusive interview this week with HUMAN EVENTS.

“What seems astonishing today could become conventional wisdom in a short period of time,” Forbes said.

Such a move would help to stabilize the value of the dollar, restore confidence among foreign investors in U.S. government bonds, and discourage reckless federal spending, the media mogul and former presidential candidate said.  The United States used gold as the basis for valuing the U.S. dollar successfully for roughly 180 years before President Richard Nixon embarked upon an experiment to end the practice in the 1970s that has contributed to a number of woes that the country is suffering from now, Forbes added.

If the gold standard had been in place in recent years, the value of the U.S. dollar would not have weakened as it has and excessive federal spending would have been curbed, Forbes told HUMAN EVENTS.  The constantly changing value of the U.S. dollar leads to marketplace uncertainty and consequently spurs speculation in commodity investing as a hedge against inflation.

The only probable 2012 U.S. presidential candidate who has championed a return to the gold standard so far is Rep. Ron Paul (R.-Tex.).  But the idea “makes too much sense” not to gain popularity as the U.S. economy struggles to create jobs, recover from a housing bubble induced by the Federal Reserve’s easy-money policies, stop rising gasoline prices, and restore fiscal responsibility to U.S. government’s budget, Forbes insisted.

With a stable currency, it is “much harder” for governments to borrow excessively, Forbes said.  Without lax Federal Reserve System monetary policies that led to the printing of too much money, the housing bubble would not have been nearly as severe, he added.

“When it comes to exchange rates and monetary policy, people often don’t grasp” what is at stake for the economy, Forbes said.  By restoring the gold standard, the United States would shift away from “less responsible policies” and toward a stronger dollar and a stronger America, he said.  “If the dollar was as good as gold, other countries would want to buy it.”

An encouraging sign for Forbes is that key lawmakers besides Rep. Paul are recognizing that the Fed is straying well beyond its intended role of promoting stable prices and full employment with its monetary policies.

Forbes cited Rep. Paul Ryan (R.-Wis.), who, he believes, understands monetary policy better than most lawmakers and has shown a willingness to ask tough but necessary questions.  For example, when Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke appeared before the House Budget Committee in February, Ryan, who chairs the panel, asked Bernanke bluntly how many jobs the Fed’s quantitative-easing program had helped to create.

Politicians need to “get over” the notion that the Fed can guide the economy with monetary policy.  The Fed is like a “bull in a China shop,” Forbes said.  “It can’t help but knock things down.”

“People know that something is wrong with the dollar,” Forbes concluded.  “You cannot trash your money without repercussions.”

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  • beezdotcom

    “At no time during my educational experiences have I been preached to about Socialism.” Well, sure. Nobody CALLS it that while you’re soaking in it.

  • theophany

    Booms and busts are part of the nature of the market. They are also part of the nature of a loose monetary policy (many have argued the latter are for worse and more frequent than the former.) It is a common red herring to suggest that the “gold bug” thinks a gold standard prevents the former when it’s usual clear from context they mean the latter. Furthermore, the idea, when presented, that an entity like the Federal Reserve actually mitigates the former is usually lacking evidence that it doesn’t cause and exacerbate the latter.

  • Htos1

    Exactly!What is the fed going to do,hire an army for payment?

  • Richard Traegler

    Forget the gold standard. First, we don’t have enough to support the currency needs of the country. Two, whomever is holding the gold will have the power. Much better way is to simply allow the Treasury to fulfill it’s Constitutional duty and start printing US dollars instead of borrowing Federal Reserve Notes. We could pay off the national debt as quickly as we could print the money.

  • Barack_Obozo

    ROTFLMFAO!!!! You are a testament to the government education. I suggest you start educating yourself and start being an American and not a statist automaton.

  • Judge

    We’ve been on the gold std before – it failed miserably. While any system (such as fiat money) can be abused, we have enjoyed unparalled prosperity the past 75 years, due to the availability of capital to entrepreneurs. This won’t happen on gold – it concentrates the money (power) in banker’s hands and raises the cost of money – making new businesses and home ownership much more difficult. We also had inflation/devaluation on the gold std.

    Also gold std’s don’t allow for liquidity supply in emergencies – such as 9/11. If we had a fixed money supply, we’d be a 3rd world economy by now. We literally came within hours in 2007 of having massive global banking failures. People simply have no idea. And the housing bubble wasn’t caused by the Fed’s liquidity after 9/11, it was caused by revisions to the CRA in 1995 forcing banks to do subprime and FNMA/FHLMC’s decision in 99 to securitize subprimes and put the gov’ts AAA rating on them…

    Gold is a simplistic solution to a complex problem. Therefore, it is likely a wrong solution.

  • Cranios

    Forbes says a return to the Gold Standard would “…discourage reckless federal spending…”

  • JohnsGualt

    No I don’t. I know Glenn Beck talked about it a lot, but then I got sick and tired of his conspiracy theories about how the world would end unless we all revert back to the 1700′s. “I can’t tell you right now America, but tune in tomorrow and I will reveal how the world will end. Buy Gold at 1-800-Goldline” Glenn Beck Much?
    The point I am trying to make is for people to think for their own best interests. They may coincide with the likes of Beck and the talking heads, but I doubt most of their listeners share the same financial security as they do.

  • Michael M

    Let’s balance the budget and refuse to pay on the debt. Just say, “make me”… while our guns are still bigger and badder.

  • Htos1

    Bigbankers ARE liberals(actually ex-pat russian bolsheviks).


    Only problem I see here is….. Where the heck are you going to find 14+ trillion in gold? Not that I disagree with the need to return to asset based money, the problem is that there are not enough assets on earth to cover the notes that would have to be grandfathered in. That leaves two options that I can see. Abject default of previous notes to match the amount of gold in Fort Knox plus that which can be obtained via confiscation, or, a major gamble on extraterrestrial mining – which we have been saddly remiss in developing since Apollo.

  • SarahC

    I don’t know that he is outright for returning to the gold standard, but he is certainly advocating going down a road where that would at least be possible. I love Ron Paul, but he can’t win. Herman Cain can win. He’s the black Ronald Regan!

  • Barack_Obozo

    Hey you ever use a credit card…when you do you seem to be richer…until the bill comes due.

  • Htos1

    I thought he was a small business man(Godfather’s pizza).

  • Guest

    why dont you get back to all of us when you have finished grad school and paid your way in the real world for about 20 years, provide a few folks with paychecks, take some risks with your money, and then watch the government steal it. talk to me about socialism then.

  • Barack_Obozo

    A collective solution correct?

  • Palgrave Ashaman

    Dear JohnsGualt,

    I came up through the public education system. I went to a state University, and now I am about to start graduate school. Throughout my entire education I have been bombarded by socialist ideology. Please stop speaking down to others like a condescending a$$ and telling people that a spade is not a spade. Also, try to listen to some talk radio, especially Rush. He makes some wonderful points, and he is dead on the money when it comes to pointing out the utter stupidity of our modern education system in this country. He’s also good at pissing elitists like yourself off, so I encourage you to listen.

  • gluflin

    The article claims Steve Forbes said it makes it *harder* to the federal government to spend as recklessly as it currently does. It does not say anything about eliminating the risk entirely.

    The point is valid, but, it does not seem at odds with what the article is saying.

  • Barack_Obozo


  • JohnsGualt

    Well, joessherditbefore. I am a veteran of the Afghan war, I have a purple heart and was nominated for the Silver Star. I am going to Grad School on the GI Bill. A “socialist program,” as you would like to call it. I grew up on a farm, where since the age of 13 I got up at 3:30 in the morning to milk cows. I have a retirement accoutn vested in the stock market. I have a mortgage that I pay off every month. Don’t lecture me on how life works. I work to make my life what I want it to be.

  • captnjoe

    Bring it on. I am tired of waiting.

  • gluflin

    I think I’m in line with your thinking on this Networth. The American population would never sit idly by at this point and see their free handouts taken away. The percentage of voters on the dole is too great, the dependency too well rooted.

  • Fester

    I think that is just a sales pitch to reach the common man. I have researched him and he sounds just like a bankster. Also I hated his debate answer about foreign policy. The Cain response was “I’ll just leave that to the “experts”.

  • texan59

    I would suggest that the education system you have grown up in and continue to wallow in has done their job. You are what they call a success story. You have been in the system so long that you don’t know the difference of what you speak and what you live. I would suggest that you actually go out and get a job. You would have a much different perspective. I would wager that you could tell us a great deal about such things as social and economic justice. You need to do some reading outside the suggested tomes of your exalted professors. Those of us a few years older than you do not need to listen to the dulcet tones of the talkers each and every day to understand the difference between the Country we grew up in and the place the leaders of today want to take us. Get out of school and get a job.

  • Stmaximus

    And John, in all due respect — even while Fred painted with a wide brush — you might consider giving your “government school claptrap” and self-righteous preaching a bit of a rest until you have (finally) exited the soft surrounding of academia and worked in the real world for awhile, suffered the continual burden of real taxes, gotten beaten up (and even, perhaps, triumphed a bit) in the working world, attempted to start a business, perhaps, and actually contributed something of value to the commonweal. And that’s not to mention taking on the burden (and joys) of building a family, having and raising kids, paying for births, braces, weddings, etc.

    In short — your theoretical life so far is not one most would begrudge you — we’re all kids once. But you might consider re-reading Fred’s screed, and considering that maybe, just maybe, despite his anxious and generalized tone — there might perhaps be a wisdom there that you haven’t yet — and won’t encounter — until you leave the ivory tower behind and join us in the real world.

  • Scott Heckman

    18% – and that is the magic number Mike. Not many people know this, but since 1913, and with few exceptions, Federal tax receipts have been 17-19% of GDP. Marginal tax rates do not affect this greatly. So, when we cut tax rates and spur the economy, the government still gets 17-19% of a larger economic pie. When tax rates are raised, stifling the economy, the government still gets 17-19% of a smaller economic pie.

    SO..let’s pass Mike Lee’s amendment to stop deficit spending and let’s stop the class warfare of demonizing the rich over taxes. When the FedGov lowers marginal tax rates, they invest, make more, pay more, and create more jobs for the rest of us.

  • JohnsGualt

    That’s fine. I can see where I was condescending in that post. I grew up on talk radio, and have since gotten tired of it. I guess there really is no area of compromise when competing ideologies invoke so much emotional behind one way or another. Did not want to offend anyone, I mearly wanted to present another way of thinking.

  • mrburke

    Then you went to bad schools because I talk about socialism, communism, and fascism all the time in my econ class. One can’t highlight the benefits of decentralized market order without showing the travesty of the command systems.

  • geogeoff

    John, why don’t you get out of the fake world of academia and get into the real world of making it on your own. Then you will know what a farce this government has become. You have been taught lies if you have taken economics (Keysian economics). They may not come right out and say this is marxism etc. but many of their techniques are leaning that directions. Time for you to get out from living under your parents umbrella and welcome to the new world of 20 percent unemployment. Hope you major in something other than basket weaving 101, because I for one am fed up with paying high taxes to help you unemployed people with worthless degrees.

  • Guest

    id like to see preemptive mass peaceful protests of those in power currently before riots in the streets become inevitable. a peaceful 30 million man march on washington that lasts until we have a fair tax, health care repeal, return to the gold standard, a plan to lock down the border, and the removal of the obama administration and all the bought and paid for politicians. obama supports humanities god given right to political protest and to overthrow their leaders, he’s bombing libya on that premise, in his own words. lets see what happens when he cracks down on that in the USA.

  • JohnsGualt

    Why wouldn’t they call it that? Is it some big secret they are trying to hide? Maybe it is another boogeyman in the closet. Glenn Beck Much?

  • pete838

    @JohnsGualt:disqus Just because Lenin and Marx aren’t being quoted by the New Socialist Party (the Democrat Party) doesn’t mean that the tenets of socialism aren’t being followed. Norman Mattoon Thomas, leading American socialist and six time Socialist Party of America presidential candidate said in 1944
    “The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism.
    But, under the name of “liberalism”,
    they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program,
    until one day America will be a socialist nation,
    without knowing how it happened.
    I no longer need to run as a Presidential Candidate for the Socialist Party.
    The Democratic Party has adopted our platform.”Even the so-called conservative party have made peace with socialism in several forms, namely various social programs. Our founding parents would have never seen fit to take from one American and distribute to another. In fact, when discussing public assistance for French refugees, James Madison said ”
    I cannot undertake to lay my finger
    on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of
    expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents.”

    Nearly a hundred years later Grover Cleveland said ”
    I can find no warrant for such an appropriation [drought
    relief] in the Constitution, and I do not believe that the power and
    duty of the General Government ought to be extended to the relief of
    individual suffering which is in no manner properly related to the
    public service or benefit.” But today Republicans have made peace with Medicaid, Medicare, Social Security, etc., and Democrats are pressing for even more, yes, SOCIALIST/MARXIST/LENINIST programs that make citizens less dependent on themselves and more so on government to carry out the fiduciary responsibilities of daily life. I think about how these thing affect my personal situation every Friday when I see the percentage of my pay the government has extracted from me without my consent, and I have a crystal clear view of the world as it actually is. Maybe if you lend me your rose colored glasses I won’t see socialism for what it is.

  • JohnsGualt

    That is a fair point to make stmaximus, but as I said.

    Well, joessherditbefore. I am a veteran of the Afghan war, I have a purple heart and was nominated for the Silver Star. I am going to Grad School on the GI Bill. A “socialist program,” as you would like to call it. I grew up on a farm, where since the age of 13 I got up at 3:30 in the morning to milk cows. I have a retirement accoutn vested in the stock market. I have a mortgage that I pay off every month. Don’t lecture me on how life works. I work to make my life what I want it to be.

  • sirgareth


    They don’t need to preach about it, they live it. To the “edutocracy” schools and their education unions government is viewed as a beneficial uncle bestowing gifts upon those he views as righteous.

    This is not how the founders viewed the promise of america. They saw goverment as a snake…good to set upon your enemy but dangerous to ones own freedom and safety at the same time. They put a straight jacket upon it and called it “the constitution” but were wary that it wasn’t enough.

    They provided a system for amending it should that become necessary. They never envisioned a court that could “interpret” its meaning in times to come.

    The idea that the federal government could regulate the size and shape of a candle, buy up failed buggy companies, the size of the hole in the outhouse, rescind legal contacts, tell people how much hay they could feed their horses etc etc etc would have been beyond their comprehension.

    Today government “educates” us by telling us how benign they are while they control every aspect of our daily commerce and take nearly half of our income while putting our children into debt servitude. The path to Marxism is well established and we are well upon it

  • Fester

    Why are so many people duped and led astray? I am saddened by so much blindness. Read the real facts on this guy!

  • jerrypell

    Seems to me YOUR carrying the water for someone else…..Hmmmm…I wonder who that could be…..if that were a conservative writing what you just did, it would be called insensitive, racist and hate filled, the liberals are flushing this country down the toilet!

  • Guest

    thanks for fighting for your country. hope the war does not come here when the reds are going for gold.

  • Liberal Soup N Crackers

    I believe a strong case could be made that much of our nations economic ills with regard to monetary policy originated with the move away from gold backing of our currency. However, that case needs to be presented and examined well.

  • chrisj49

    Obviously it wasn’t preached. You were indoctrinated, telltale sign, your envy and hatred of the rich, who I’m sure employ and help far more people than you do or ever will.

  • pete838

    The G.I. Bill is not a socialist program. It is part of your payment for services rendered during your employment in the armed forces. If it was given with no strings attached it would be socialist.

    Many employers provide education funding as part of their compensation package.

  • geogeoff

    Sure you did not get a bleeding heart…..what dribble. A veteran of the Afghan war? Were you fighting for the Taliban?

  • squawneye

    Our army is bigger than their army.

  • JohnsGualt

    I agree with most of what you just said, but that is not socialism, communism, and fascism. That is the whole point.

  • Fester

    Google Herman Cain – Federal Reserve – Supports Tarp Bailouts – The list goes on….. Plus Godfather’s Pizza was crap. Don’t let the smooth talk fool you!!!!!!

  • Barack_Obozo

    Indoctrination rarely states it’s true nature

  • freestateyank

    Cain went against TARP as it morphed from it’s original purpose. Cain’s point is that an audit is less necessary than getting a handle on spending. Regardless of the FED, if Congress and WH were not signing off on nutty spending, we wouldn’t be in this position.

  • pete838

    Four years ago I couldn’t understand the hype over Ron Paul. The more I pay attention, though, the more sense he makes. Ron Paul ’12!

  • JohnsGualt

    Nah, lets go back to social darwinism.

  • Reasonsjester

    I have taken Marx and Marxism and Communist and Postcommunist Politics at the doctoral level, and I can tell you the faculty of my state university in the northeast was completely filled with socialists. We had a self-proclaimed Marxist-Leninist professor (who sometimes sided with Keynes), a Maoist, a neomarxist, and several other soft socialists – I guess you could call it a “diverse” faculty. But here’s the kicker. You don’t spread the ideas of Marx and Lenin in the schools by citing them. You appeal to “democracy” or “social justice” or a number of critical theory movements like radical feminism, etc. which implant the necessary cognates to instrumentalize the “useful idiots.” You recruit the brighter academics and then move them, and only them, over to formal study when they get to the upper levels of grad school. Only a few are given the information to integrate the intentionally diffuse and disparate information and can think “critically” about the subject (only within the socialist context). Spare me the nonsense about not hearing about Marx and Lenin in school. Of course you didn’t.

  • JohnsGualt

    Good one, that is not an extreme view at all.

  • TC

    If you grew up on talk radio and actually listened to it, you wouldn’t have abandoned it, unless it was liberal talk radio and Air America that you listened to. Liberalism, Progressivism, Socialism, Communism, Marxism… They are all the same because they lead to the same place. The only difference between them is the speed with which you get there.

  • JohnsGualt

    Never said I hate the rich.

  • JohnsGualt

    A bit extreme maybe.

  • Guest

    That’s right Htos1. They sure are.

  • Guest

    @ Jon – You wrote – “The US is not going into the next century as a soveriegn nation. That’s been the plan all along.” Were Obama to speak these words now we’d be hearing the only truthful statement he’s uttered during his term.

  • pete838

    Herman Cain is also in favor of global US military intervention and US imperialism abroad. No thanks.

    Ron Paul would reduce or eliminate our involvement in foreign affairs that have no direct impact on US national security.

  • Reasonsjester

    Fascism is the rotting corpse of capitalism before the transition to socialism in some Marxian theorists’ view. Fascism and socialism are just two different techniques for the state to control the use of property.

  • JohnsGualt

    fair enough.

  • Guest

    You won’t go off the fiat currency without a shooting war. And I mean that literally.

  • jimmy legaro

    Socialist? Marxist? Fascist? Corporatist? We are all these things. Look at what Chuck Schumer is proposing. A “No Train” list identical to the “No Fly” list. What’s next? A “No Work” list? How about the Homeland Security text message to all cell phones warning of alerts? Presidential messages to all cell phones? Constant war? Constant terror alerts? 1984 anyone?

    Our decent into tyranny has gone quite far and frankly will be extremely difficult to reverse. Honestly I’m happy I’m 55 years of age, I lived my youth in a much freer time.

  • Stmaximus

    Hey –

    Thanks for the response. First point — you apparently don’t like to be
    “lectured to,” which is curious, noting the lecture you delivered to Fred.

    Second and more important point — I will take you at your word regarding
    your resume — thank you so much for your service to our country. Much
    appreciated, and can never be repaid — though we will attempt via our
    “socialist” GI bill. : )

    Glad to hear of your farm background, your work ethic and your investments
    in and for the future. Keep up the good work. Way to go in wishing to
    “make your life the way you want it to be.”

    I wish you the best. Even so just know that life has a way of presenting
    us with twists in the trail, so, continue. Work hard, plan, and hope for
    and build for the best. And then, (sorry for the lecture here!) when those
    twists come, I hope for you that you have discovered a source of God’s
    grace to take you successfully through those times.

    Best of everything to you, and agin, thanks for your service.


    JohnsGualt wrote, in response to Stmaximus:

  • Peter S. Lewicki

    The Chinese government is quietly accumulating gold in its central bank reserves. China was the biggest gold producing nation in the world last year and appears set to repeat that record this year and into the future. China only has 2% of its reserves in gold right now, and seeks to increase that percentage dramatically in the years ahead, diversifying out of the USD hoard it now has (in the form of US Treasury securities). There are 3 Trillion of reserves which the Chinese will redeploy in more gold and possibly silver accumulations. At that point, if not before, China will have a fully convertible yuan and compete with the weakening USD and troubled euro. What this means for the gold standard, is that the Chinese (and others) will press for an international basket of currencies partially backed by gold. So, if we don’t see the gold standard put in place in the next 5 years, we will have a closely similar form of wealth for nations to hold in their reserves. The dollar and the euro will be overtaken by events as the governments who sponsor those currencies continue to spiral down the debt path to financial oblivion.

  • Guest

    Obama is Bush 3.

  • Reasonsjester

    Ron Paul is for alternative gold and/or silver currency, by the way, to ease any hypothetical transition back to a specie currency standard.

  • Guest

    Good point. And this has been the case for 50 years now. It’s called “Cultural Marxism.”

  • Guest

    hay without you i would not have the freedom to have an opinion.

  • RepublicansHateTheTruth

    And I predict the Republicans will raise the debt ceiling by a trillion dollars or more so deficit spending can continue as usual.

  • earlycsa

    Exactly the catalyst for what? Government will have to enforce control. Control of resources especially food as the Food “stamp” program goes universal to all of us, or rationing by another name. Obama is continually pushing as an experienced community “organizer” agitator for social unrest (crisis not to waste) as the excuse for “The Change” to be completed. Just follow Hugo Chavez and you’ve got the game plan, or for once believe your “lying” eyes. Prepare and CYA, government is not going to “save” you, in fact it has been destroying your wealth for decades,and the country in the process.

    Just WHO has committed Treason and to whom?

  • Barack_Obozo

    So after you get off here will you go back and tell everyone in your classes that you did your best to educate the unwashed masses? Just for you own edification you are dealing with professionals here lawyers, doctors, PhDs and entrepreneurs so though you are garnering attention please open you mind to people who are far better educated through various systems including real life practical experience. If you are a true student you’ll take what you learn (read) here and apply it to your hypothetical constructs and synthesize a new understanding

  • Nurlman

    The government isn’t entrusted with the money supply. The Federal Reserve, a private company, run by the large banks controls the supply. I for one believe the government, accountable to its citizens, should control the supply.

  • JohnsGualt

    That’s fair Stmaximus,
    I generally do not reply, or post on any of these stories, because the comments get mean spirited and hateful. Neither of those emotions are very constructive, in my opinion.
    Generally, I do not think either side of the political isle, or either extreme, is reasonable in any of their suggested solutions. But that is just my opinion, and I am probably wrong. If I am, I will be the first to admit it.


  • Joe Mama

    Except, if we want US exports to recover the goal is to have the dollar trade lower so we can compete internationally.

  • Sarah

    Gold standard would set the price in stone, and the rarity would slow the country from 670 mph to 5 mph. I have made a few calculations using historical prices of items used by common people for daily living. It’s not an exact dollar amount but this is as close as I could get. Today, Gold would have to be the standard and the price would be $69,677-$73,006 per oz. Silver would be approximately $4,756. per oz……I am not laughing at the devaluation of the dollar

  • dmacleo

    cost me plenty and was not as easy to use as advertised. its a benefit but not free.

  • Guest

    How about oil?

    I don’t see the New World Order being a gold standard kind of place. I see it being another fiat currency ponzi scheme. But, if there is a standard of value, it would have to be something plentiful enough to back a one world currency.

  • geogeoff

    JohnsGualt and your belief that the government is not liberal or marxists is a FOOLISH idea. That sounds just like a liberal..whenever someone does not agree with you, you claim they are extreme. Hey I got a purple heart also, I bought it off of ebay. What did you get yours for, did you get a blister from sitting on your brain at a supply depot?

  • David Irvin

    Some of you people need to read the Communist Manifesto, so that you’ll understand why the word “Marxism” isn’t derogatory.

  • WardC

    Dr. Ron Paul has been saying this for 30 years. Return to gold standard, stop the Fed. Is he right or what? Now all the flip flopping presidential candidates will change their tune whereas they criticized Dr. Paul before. But we know better. Ron Paul 2012!

  • Guest

    So, we will trade our fiat currency/fractional reserve banking for a pseudo gold backed currency.

    Let me see, instead of them stealing through inflation, they will just come seize your gold like they did during the last depression. Hmmmm, which way to go, which way to go.

    If people have not heard, the Irish government has begun steps to tax the pensions of their citizens. Governments cannot stop their spending so you will see the inevitable here also. It has already been suggested by many to just seize all private pensions and force them into purchasing government bonds.

    Pffft, remember your history folks. What does every government do when facing financial Armageddon and loss of power?

  • Fester

    An audit of the Fed is necessary to discredit them forever in the public eye. Boobus Americanus needs to know how destructive they are. Stop supporting gatekeepers.

  • MusicCityDAwg

    For all those people who talk about going to the Gold Standard, no one has yet explained exactly how to do it. Current M2 Money is approximately $8.9T, this is what will have to be backed by gold. If you took ALL of the gold ever mined in the history of humanity that is currently in some refined form at today’s market prices, you would have somewhere in the ballpark of $7.8T. So how do you do it, corner the market on gold? Drive the price of gold to $50,000/oz.? Deflate prices to 1920s levels? HOW do you do it without creating EXTREME market disruptions? Furthermore, for the majority of the time we were on the gold standard previously, the price of gold was fixed at $35/oz. and required the cooperation of all the developed nations to go along with it. Sorry, but I just don’t see that happening.

  • retiredone

    As a former teacher, after retiring several years ago, I was able to see the impression of Socialism upon our students through the emphasis of political beliefs, lifestyles, nuances, etc… preached from the classroom lecterns on a daily basis. My experience spanned grades 6 – 12 and college.

    Socialism can be taught without the names of historical figures responsible for shaping this type of belief system, or the historical stages leading up to implementation.

  • JohnsGualt

    Costs more than I would ever be willing to pay again.

  • Granny Rob Robinson

    Nope, ain’t gonna happen … there aren’t enough Republicans with guts to force a return to sanity based on something more than a “promise to pay” when it comes to U.S. currency. This country is well on the path to destruction, culturally and politically … and the only hope is a miracle we don’t deserve.

  • Guest

    I did that awhile back and I also came up with numbers similar to yours. Quite eye opening isn’t it?

  • earlycsa

    GM = Government Motors, Much? Don’t believe your lying eyes. I hope your sight picture wasn’t this blurred in service, or perhaps you weren’t the point of the spear?

  • JohnsGualt

    I never said the Government wasn’t liberal. Again, the terms are not exchangeable. As far as the purple heart is concerned, I should have never brought it up.

  • David Irvin

    Why don’t they pin the dollar to a bushel of corn, or a tub of goat cheese? It doesn’t really matter, so long as the underlying asset has some value. Currently, the underlying asset is a government ruined by an empire it can no longer support with the tax dollars of an unwilling public.

  • Joe Mama

    Let’s play a game called “who remembers the Regan years?”

    1) Giant plunge in US dollar values from 1981-1986

    2) Giant PLUNGE in commodities markets (contrary to this article that says dollar volatility is leading to commodities prices going up)

    3) Giant RECOVERY in the job markets…

    Falling dollar == STRONGER EXPORTS

  • marine_engineer

    JohnsGualt, your writing reflects the typical immaturity of a student only familiar with the small world you live in yet arrogant enough to judge us. You have not exerienced anything of the real world as those of us that work extremely hard only to see the fruits of our labor confiscated and redistributed against our will. Here’s a hint sparky, many of us went to grad school too; and others have achieved great success with no formal education at all, yet you lecture us as if you are some enlightend one. Grow up, you’re nobody special.

  • jackrorabbit

    This would explain why you haven’t been taught “socialism”. Growing up in farm country means that your teachers are more likely to be conservative. Try going to an inner city school, and you will see that there is a major difference from what the self-employed, hard working, and low jobless areas teach, vs. the living in a big city, where unemployment is rampant, the government pays for most if not all of the schooling costs, including breakfast and lunch for the kids, and where if you have a job it is for a minimum wage, so you get food stamps to cover the rest. I would also be willing to bet that you went to a business degree, and a business masters, both of which are controlled by conservative thinking, save economics that one is 50/50.

  • VonSloneker

    Ayn smiled…

  • Mark Adam

    There is no compromise between Food and Poison.

  • SpringerRider

    Seems like every liberal claims they were war heroes. Heroes behind the keyboard come pretty cheap these days. I did 30 years but make no effort to blather about my time in country. The old saying is, “those that did, don’t talk about it and those that didn’t, do!”
    I guess if you were really in the military, you slid by the Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell policy.

  • Sarah

    Exactly. Value for daily living, not starbucks ($3.99 for a coffee worth $.04) but bread, butter, ammo

  • jekyllisle

    Wow, it seems that public education can’t teach people to see what is directly in front of them.

    Medicare, Social Security, The Health Care Bill, The FDA, The Public School System & The EPA are all forms or tools of Socialism but according to you they are only preached about by “right wingers”.

    Think about what these tools and organizations do on a daily basis. They take from the healthy, wealthy, successful and intelligent and redistribute to those that are unhealthy, poor, broke & dumb.

    The ones carrying water for the rich are the democrats. Have you ever asked yourself how money is created outside of just printing it?

    Figure that out and then pipe back in on what you were and were not taught in your Public School.

    You will find out that back in 1913 the democrats lined up to make the rich even richer and they have continued to do it ever since

  • Guest

    I suggested about a year ago tying it to a conglomerate of commodities instead of just one. This would stabilize the currency more.

  • JohnsGualt

    Why is this response so filled with hate? I take every lesson I learn in life and apply it to my behavior. Why would you have the username, Barack Obozo? He is the President for goodness sakes. Argumentam ad hominem much?

  • joejohnson043

    maybe sometime during your State Sponsored Education you should have read the book Animal Farm…. just sayin….

  • Layla

    Google Cloward and Piven. Can’t believe an academic such as yourself has never heard of it. You may be stupid, others are not. Beck isn’t making this stuff up, it’s verifiable and right on the money.

  • JohnsGualt

    That’s not extreme at all. Let me know where you will be running for office, so I can vote for you.

  • Fester


  • jackrorabbit

    I find it sad that instead of engaging in the debate of ideas, you choose instead to deride a member of our society, that has put his life on the line for you to be allowed to say such drivel. I am the founder of the local Tea Party, and disagree with his point of view regarding our schooling, but I will never besmirch what he was willing to do for me, and for the US.

  • Stmaximus

    Funny thing, but I don’t typically reply or post, myself, for the same

    Thanks for the interchange, however. And I trust the grad schools venture
    goes well for you and that (should you wish) you discover upon its
    completion that you have increased your marketability via your studies.

    Stay nimble — it’s a very dynamic market out there.

    Take care,


    JohnsGualt wrote, in response to Stmaximus:

  • John Tunmire

    Don’t forget to add that you walked 10 miles to school in the freezing weather in the winter. Your story sounds like a lot of hype.

  • JohnsGualt

    You just did blather about your service. As far as the don’t ask don’t tell policy, that is a good argument. You should stick with it, it reveals who you really are.

  • Sarah

    Children today don’t see a need to bring babies into the world. Immigrants will slow to a trickle once Generous Benefits cease. WHO will pay for the social necessities for this generation? I see in the FUTURE…Major Cuts in all benefits for me, my wife, and children. We can not sustain the current spending…(There are only so many trees to make paper) Hyperinflation has to come about for fiat currency to balance

  • Guest

    When you keep your head while all about you others are losing theirs, maybe you don’t get it. In any event, your dismissal of talk radio’s only truth dispensers establishes the likelihood that you would benefit from a week listening to them.

  • drparadox

    Originally Cain was a supporter of TARP, so you know where his free market loyalties are. From my previous post, the phrases in quotes are Cain’s words. Cain is afraid of what auditing the FED would bring, an understanding of the monetary system. If you want Congress to stop spending like a drunk sailor, you have to remove their tool (the FED) which gives them the ability to spend. You can never pay off a debt, if you owe money (to the FED) every time a dollar is created.

  • Eugene

    Those aren’t applicable because all refer to specific ideologies.

    What is actually preached is collectivism: the philosophy that everyone is both interdependant on each other (as opposed to independent individuals), whose right’s individual rights are secondary to the “greater good” as determined by the governing body.

  • earlycsa

    Sure, just make the dollar worth less like since the LBJ-Nixon Era, worth less each year just so we can compete globally, then years become decades of the dollar worth less and less until following you and the FED make it WORTHLESS.

  • joejohnson043

    you are right about Beck, he is a Charlatan. However, finding counterfeit money doesn’t mean there was never a real dollar it was pretending to me. Beck was a misinformation tool. Regardless, the facts are we are moving towards government’s control of everything.

  • JohnsGualt

    You’re right, I am nobody special. That wasn’t the point of what I was saying. All I said was for him to think for himself. Is that a bad thing?

  • stubabe

    China, India, Russia, South American countries, Middle Eastern countries are all dumping their dollars and buying gold and silver. That is why the metals prices keep climbing in spite of the fact Wall Street banks keep naked shorting the prices with the help of the Federal Reserve. These countries do not want our debt and see the handwriting on the wall. Most of our money is now printed by the Fed since no one is buying our Treasuries. The USA dollar as a world currency is rapidly being passed up. Its not like we have a choice here. When the other countries have currencies pinned to commodities like metals and oil, the dollar will become toilet paper. Predictions on the future price of gold and silver range from $3000-$10,000 oz and silver 1/15th price of gold, or $200-$500/oz. A basket of metals with platinum and palladium as well as oil, could be the peg to the currency. Fractional Reserve Banking would be over along with Wall Street corruption and fraud by default. The $64 dollar question is how much gold does the USA still have. Did it get leased out over the years and that is why the Fed is so anxious over an audit.

  • jackrorabbit

    There are others that are just as viable as Ron Paul, like Herman Cain.

  • JohnsGualt

    You would know John Tunmire. After all, you have lived right alongside me.

  • joejohnson043

    ouch, that was spot on!

  • Harrison_Bergeron45

    John, I’m with you buddy. Thank you for serving and it is people like you that give me a small bit of hope for this country. If the people lambasting you were thinking people at all, they would jump off the talking head bandwagon for one second and approach these issues from a logical standpoint. I would recommend Congressman Paul’s books to anyone who really wants to take a good hard look at American monetary policy and also for anyone who wants to study Austrian Economics, which Paul is a huge proponent of and actually pertains to this article. Also, for everone else, Communism is the entire country supposed to be controlled and owned by the people equally. Fascism is an authoritarian political state where all of industry and government are heavily controlled by a one party ruling power. Socialism is the idea that all are to be equal as seen in Harrison Bergeron. On a side note, I appreciate the Atlas Shrugged reference.

  • theBuckWheat

    There are, broadly speaking, only two ways of sustaining human life: by creating wealth or by seizing it from others. The only economic system where all parties create wealth is the system of free exchange. In all other systems, however structured, some or all parties in an exchange are forced to receive less than a satisfactory outcome.

    Socialism is the fraudulent attempt to force everyone to live at the expense of everyone else. Christians will see how it is morally fraudulent because it violates three of the Ten Commandments: lies, coveting and theft. Secularists will at least see that it cannot be imposed without the use of the creditable threat of violence via government. Economists understand that the socialist economy cannot function efficiently because government intrusion in economic decisions destroys essential pricing information. An economy cannot function when the person making the decisions about a particular function cannot know if his outputs exceed his inputs. (Making a profit is mandatory, or finite capital is consumed. When capital is exhausted, the function fails.) This is exactly what destroyed the Soviet Union.

  • Sarah

    I try doing business here in China. Its very difficult for them to accept my dollars. I exchange in Euro’s they balk, I convert into Gold and I am in business. But I need these trinkets to sell to Americans, who simply can’t get enough

  • Gary

    You mean like religion? There’s some indoctrination for ya!

  • JohnsGualt

    I would like to thank everyone for participating in such an uplifting and constructive conversation. I apologize if I offended anyone, as it was not my intention to do so. With that I will continue in my studies, I for one do not think it is a bad thing to be in Grad School.
    Peace Out.

  • jackrorabbit

    Sadly, the only way that we could afford to go onto the “Gold Standard” would be to revalue the dollar to such a degree as it would be worth the gold that backs it. Right now, we have about 2 Trillion in gold and silver to back our 14 Trillion economy. So until we are willing to take a pinch in the pocket and swap in 7 dollars for 1 American dollar, then we cannot get back to that point. Strap on the safety belt, because the Wiemar Republic is the only way to get back to this point. That and we would have to abandon all of the social programs that we cannot afford.

  • Joe Mama

    That’s going to be so awesome. In boom times commodities will be expensive and drive deflation and in bust times drive inflation.

  • Randall Stephens

    Ron Paul suggests investment in gold based (or words to that effect) accounts not be taxed on capital gains.

  • Carl

    We are addicted to the hidden tax of inflation. No way to escape inflation, even if you are the China, or Japan. Everyone pays. No exceptions. The gold standard would eliminate this hidden tax we all know about, we all pay. A nice GM Suberban was $30 or $40 thousand. Now they are $50 to $60 thousand. Same SUV, but the dollar got smaller so that the debt is much less as a % of GDP. So, forget about gold. It will never be the standard, becuase the theves in Washington DC will not be able to steal from you as much as they do now.

  • James Baker

    What do you call social security, medicare and the trillions of other publically funded programs run by the government. This IS socialism, the redistribution of wealth. And as the government has got bigger and bigger (massively so since the 70′s). They’ve become more and more socialistic. How can it be that the Government spends $2+ Trillion dollars every year and it be anything else?

  • r u kidding

    “He’s the black Ronald Regan!”

    Are you insane? He’s nothing like Reagan. Reagan hated the FRS, and that’s probably why he was almost assisinated, twice. Aside from that, ODicka ruined it for all black possibles for a while. I’m for Allen West, but now he’s got no chance. Better hit the books girlie; your knowledge base is laughable.

  • ProudConservativeAmerican

    JohnsGualt, your repeated references to how much money the talk show hosts are making reveals your true nature. Of course you didn’t recognize your bath in socialism as such, but your posts sure do reveal that you received a healthy dose! So, now tell us all what is exactly wrong with healthy profits from taking a risk and producing an in-demand product, i.e. conservative talk radio?

  • Dr. Rocco Paolucci

    My Dear Sir,

    You have been schooled in “Affirmative Action”, “Political Correctness”, “Multiculturalism”, “Atheism”, “Environmentalism”, “Globalization”, etc.

    Same things as Socialism/Communism/Marxism/Fascism.

    You have learned everything…..and “nothing”!

  • JohnsGualt

    Thanks Harrison, I like I like Ron Paul. I don’t hate people who have zero influence on how I enjoy my own life. I look after my interests first, then the interests of those closest to me, and then to the rest. All I ever said in the first post was for people to think for themselves. That is all I would ever advocate, logic, reason, conclusions.


  • jackrorabbit

    There isn’t enough gold in the world to pay for our economy at the current prices. Gold would need to go to about 3500 an ounce for the world to pay our debt, and about 10,500 an ounce for our own holdings to be enough to power the 14.5 Trillion dollar economy that we have now. Probably not that high as I am forgetting the velocity part, so it would be about 1,800 an ounce for the world supply, and about 5,800 for our own stock to power it.

  • earlycsa

    Obama is the culmination of Woodrow Wilson, FDR,LBJ, Nixon,Carter,BushI,Clinton,BushII

    Welcome to the NWO, Comrades!

    WWIII will be between the Communist/Progressive Infidels and the Muslim Believers. Choose a side. Supporters of Constitutional Freedom,Christianity,Hebrews, and other vestiges of western humanity will be irrelevant.

  • Stephen

    Question: When/if we go on the gold standard again, our gov’t will need to buy up a LOT of gold to back the Dollar. (Some say there isn’t enough gold in the universe for this, but never mind that.) Who has money to corner the market in gold? China. They have trillions in OUR money, thanks to Steve Forbes’ naive view that we can freely trade with slave-wage nations on an equal basis (as they shut us out of the market and steal our patents, BTW.) End of discussion.

  • Guest

    What amazes me more than anything is that the American people have been duped so completely for so long and in spite of all warnings for 100 years. No sooner had the Fed been created than there were statesmen and patriots warning about it.

    My God. Everything I believed about this country has been a complete and utter lie. I’m just now realizing that fact more completely than ever before. And to think that my own family has served in the military for as far back as both my great grandfathers. Four generations of military retirees on both sides.

    I don’t even know if the country I’ve loved all these years even existed except in some fantasy.

  • Terryb54321

    I would like everyone to search youtube for the following 52 minute video about how the schools were taken over. “Norman Dodd On Tax Exempt Foundations”
    You will see how socialist professors were gradually put into the system and now that is all that is hired. Norman Dodd conducted the Reece Committee for congress and talked about the committee findings before his death.

  • JohnsGualt

    I’m not an academic, I am in grad school because I like to learn, and I want to work in intellectually challenging jobs. As far as the stupid comment, why the hate?

  • rboggsjr1981

    really, used and failed? Seems to me you lack the understanding that as Forbes pointed out, it worked find for over 180 years! Not to mention, the Fed DID assist (you are correct that they are not the direct cause but did assist) in causing the housing bubble, and dot com bubble for that matter. Also, putting back on the gold standard would prevent the Fed from simply printing more money at random which constantly devalues the dollar and spurs inflation.

  • Sammy

    Due to the addiction that half of this country has with feeding at the government pigsty, this will only happen after the dollar fiat currency crashes and hyperinflation takes its toll. Hopefully we will have a country left that we will some order left to do this.

  • jackrorabbit

    I find it sad that instead of engaging in debate of ideas, you choose to degrade someone over their service to our country. I think he is wrong about the education system, but I thank him for his service that allow us to have CIVIL debate on the issue. Name calling only degrades the person that is doing the calling, and only corrupts any viable point that they may have.

  • formerly_common_hyphen_sense

    I’m reading all the comments and I *think* there’s one angle everyone is missing…Forbes has increased his gold holdings and what better way to capitalize than to use his fame/name on a public podium to increase his net worth. Even if he is right, I still see him as opportunistic.

  • JohnsGualt

    Fair enough. All I said was for people to think for themselves.

  • Tony Quinn

    A fiat monetary system implies Keynesian economics. The alternative (to which you probably subscribe) is fairy tales, or voodoo as Bush Sr. called it. Nonsense. Why don’t you try spending some time in academia. You might learn something. Not everything worth knowing is something you can learn on the farm.

  • DC555

    Truth is not malleable. Facts are what they are. Change or new for the sake of change or novelty have no value in and of themselves. When one knows something to be true, ones mind should be anchored to it in a rock hard solid manner. It isn’t fear. It’s the refusal to sway from what you are certain is true. There is nothing so pathetic and sorry as a malleable jelly mind that is swayed by any new trend or person that comes along, regardless of it’s connection to reality. You seem to think otherwise.

  • SonofLiberty7

    You are entitled to your own views; I did not criticize your “views”, merely the way in which you advocate your views. You attempted to demonize the mere mention of the Constitution with a linkage to slavery, and you know damn well its not true. Reduce your value? No. Call your character into question, you bet. You’re a liar or stupid. Deal with it. Oh, and your ideas are not challenge. They’ve already played out to their whimpering end. Keep throwing insults, I’ll match and raise you.

  • SonofLiberty7

    I cannot delegit what was never legit. You two are trolls, trying to distract from the principles and logic of debate by equating people with Nazis. BTW, when was the last time you visited a holocaust museum? Who the He!! are you to compare someone to a Nazi? You should go and ponder first hand the physical evidence of the Nazi’s crimes before you go hurling a hand grenade like comparing someone to a Nazi. Do you have any idea how much my wife’s family suffered at their hands? Who do you think you are? Go think about that and what nerves you tread on. Or are you into scheudenfreude?

  • Guest

    when did peaceful protests of the obama administrations take place? when did the protests of the illegal UN OBAMA libyan war take place? i never saw that. no dont reply to me with your promotion of violence. how do i know your not some jerk trying to paint peaceful resistance as a violent movement? you are more likely a plant than some one who is being honest. no violence will be accepted from the resistance. we will not tolerate anarchists, or violent libs trying to ruin this american movement. if you do anything violent around me i will stop you. if you try to harm others you will have to go threw me.

  • greboo

    The interaction between the commenters on this article are great! I truly hope we do go back to the Gold Standard and that we can stop the indoctrination of our young in schools by the liberal left socialist loving teachers. My two children, one lawyer, one in college now, both report the covert indoctrination by liberal teachers/professors. I experienced it as well, but over time, as I did not have the luxury of full time life and college, could not afford it. HOwever, over time, was able to accomplish my college goals.

    Peace! I like my TEA strong!

  • Amyrlyn

    I am currently a college student, and I can say with authority that the indoctrination is in every class and every text book.

  • Amyrlyn

    And how have you made your billions?

  • gellero

    It’s the dollar that is inflated….gold just takes time to catch up. An ounce of gold ( $20 double eagle ) was the pay of a successful working man in the early 1900′s .

  • gellero

    the rest of the world values gold. and what exactly do we produce? Movies?

  • gellero

    Caucasian Americans rate in the top 5. Draw your own conclusions

  • Amyrlyn

    To which post are you replying?

  • earlycsa

    I would assume you read my posts, but yes I do have rational views,a 4yr Liberal Arts College degree, not that it is any guarantee of sanity. I do find your reactionary and racial slur of Caucasians revealing of your character however. Did you have any topics to discuss or debate?

  • Amyrlyn

    Wow! Just had an interesting thing happen with my new computer. Must be the hot discussion.

    I had not heard that Caucasian Americans ranked in the top 5. I am assuming that you are referring to the report that I mentioned in one of my posts that we are 25th in the world in mathematics? You asked me to draw my own conclusions, so here it is.

    First, while Caucasian Americans are quickly becoming the largest minority group in America, by and large, we are the only minority group that was not brought up with a sense of entitlement. Second, it is becoming clearer and clearer to many of us, especially those of us who are under 50, that we will never be able to retire. Third, because of the need to compete with affirmative action, coupled with large lay-offs, it has become more important then ever to be the one indispensable person working in any industry.

    These things have prompted many of us to seek out careers that we will have the ability to work in for the rest of our lives, and to be the best in that career. If it is true that Caucasian Americans rank 5th in the world in mathematics, I think that these things, more then anything else, would explain why.

    I am sorry, this comment was for gellero. I am a little new at this kind of thing so it might take a little time to catch on to how it is done. :-)

  • terry1956

    correct and socialism has nothing do do with the federal government maintaining a navy and the constitution forbidden a navy run by the states in times of peace although a state can have a navy in times of war.
    The constitution also does not forbid either private navies, private miltias, private armies nor forbid the private production of defense athough for both federal and state government may limit the private ventures within the bounds of authority in the US constitution and state constitution.

  • bernard palmer

    They are ‘so left wing’ because their finances are controlled by Socialist governments be they state or federal. Them that pays the money calls the tune.

  • sbozich

    To “love” money is to love a thing, which is counter to the teachings of Christ. Money is a tool with which we cooperate and coordinate with each other. It would likewise be wrong to “love” a hammer, but there is no sin in using that hammer towards the benefit of others.
    The underlying message of Atlas Shrugged is that profit is the highest moral good, as it represents the value of the benefit an individual provides for society. There are no contradictions. If you think you have found one, check your premise.

  • Supersniffy

    The gold standard is not a bad idea. IMHO Nixon was a fool to take us off of it. Interestingly enough, China has tried to make Copper the new gold. Unfortunately for them, the idea didn’t take off.

  • sbozich

    The problem with returning to the gold standard is that we “lock in” our debt. At this point, we have only three options to eliminate our debt:
    1. Inflate our way out of it,
    2. Produce our way out of it,
    3. Default on it.

    The only one of those that it not destructive to the nation is to produce our way out of it, but we – as a country – refuse to produce anything anymore. Last I checked our current account balance was about half a trillion in the red. I don’t see that changing anytime soon.

    If I am missing something, I welcome any other options.

  • terry1956

    the federal reserve dollar has been inflated not the US dollar.
    It takes around 25 federal reserve dollars to buy a US dollar today, yesterday it took around 27, a couple of weeks ago it took almost 35 and that was over 130% more than it took 12 months before that.
    Since constitutionally we are on a US dollar standard the annual inflation rate was over 130% but its since dropped this week.
    The US Dollar is the standard because its in the constitution twice but only the 7th amendment applies today.
    The US Dollar composition wise is almost a copy of the Spanish silver dollar or pieces of eight.
    A bimetalism was tried and its a bad idea.
    Congress can not make anything legal tender only the states can do that and it can only be gold and silver although its not wise to have legal tender laws.
    Congress can coin gold and copper coins but they and all other money should be judged by congress based on the market value in relation to the US Siver Dollar
    Congress can not run a bank or issue bank notes or bills of credit, states can not issue bank notes.
    Private individuals, firms or non profits can issue bank notes 100% backed by assets with real market value and it can be gold or silver but it doesn’t have to be.
    A bank note can be backed 100% by federal securites if the security is payed in US silver dollars or other assets of equal market value.
    Some banks to have 100% reserves of their demand deposits may issue the their checking account depositors bank notes back by stock certificates in the bank and the bank notes value would be what the market place is willing to pay for it.

  • terry1956

    gold , silver, copper, zinc, an hour of labor ( Time Dollar), product or service coupons, perfered stock certificate are transparent, federal government GDP stats are not and neither is the federal reserve dollar, the euro, the present British Pound, the Yen, the Yuan, the Swiss Franc, The Candian Dollar, the Austrilian Dollar or the IMF’s SDR’s

  • terry1956

    Well we do to but most of the poltical class in DC doesn’t because they have a high vested interest in the fiat high leveraged currency and banking system.
    Its their gravy train.

  • terry1956

    MY how the democrat party has changed.
    Jackson hated paper money for good reason and he hated the central bank and he killed the bank.

  • Tony

    You could just as easily be a fascist if you disagree with the idea of individual liberty; Fascism and Communism are both Progressive ideologies that are in complete conflict with the principals of individual rights and limited government that this country was founded on. It you on the left that are always doing the name calling referring to anyone that disagrees with socialist ideas as fascists even when it makes no since to do so because we believe in limited government which is completely contrary to fascism. The problem is that in order to justify socialism to have to have a villainize the opposition which is hard to do if they believe in personal freedom; therefor compare them to Nazis.

  • Guest

    Gold and silver is constitutional money.Read Article 1,Section 10.We have a dishonest government due to dishonest money.

  • Ipbubba

    I agree with Fred…Obama does not want a strong US as evidenced by his actions. Stop listening and watch…

  • phillip jones

    wow how this conversation degraded. Its about the gold standard. It could bring America back to greatness. While were at it lets get rid of MADD too. They are making way too much money on the hard working folks that enjoy a drink or two. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm

  • jivedadson

    Who among you knows that Nixon “temporarily” closed the gold window, and that the dollar is still officially pegged at $42.2222 per troy ounce? Meanwhile, gold is selling for $1504 as I type this.

    Fiat money is theft. Inflation bails out the debtor-class at the expense of the saving-class, such as retirees and institutions like universities and unions. The poor and middle classes also take a big punch in the gut, because wages and entitlements never keep up with real price inflation. Food and energy go up first, just as they are doing now.

  • Duke1632

    sbozich: for whatever reason, I was unable to reply to your most current post, so this one will have to suffice.

    You posit that there are only 3 ways to extinguish the current debt of the US. However, upon further reflection, I notice (or at least will argue) there is really only 1 way for the US to become free of its debt, and that is to default. This assumes the current debt-based system remains in place. One only has access to the other two means you propose (printing and productivity) if and only if the current debt-regime is first ended.

    For support consider first why printing is not an option under our current debt-based money scheme. Printing can at most only service existing debt, while itself creates additional debt that will later need to be serviced. Being able to continually service debt (even if somehow possible to carry on indefinitely) is not the same thing as extinguishing debt. Thus, while individual debt obligations can be retired over time, doing so necessarily creates even more debt obligations greater in number or magnitude(and it’s an exponetial function). Hence, in the aggregate, US debt cannot be extinguished through printing, only perpetuated.

    As for productivity, this too is impossible when debt is a central feature of the money supply. What we know about this entity known as the FED (which you label as a “politically palatable scapegoat”–my own labels would not be so generous) is they charge perpetual “rent” to use their worthless notes. Mind you, the government or any private entity could create it’s own worthless notes, which could operate according to the same fiat rules, but without the perpetaul “rent” being due (or as Edison famously said “If the Nation can issue a dollar bond it can issue a dollar bill. The element that makes the bond good makes the bill good also. The difference between the bond and the bill is that the bond lets the money broker collect twice the amount of the bond and an additional 20%”). Irrespective of the outrageous looting (in addition to normal fiat-based looting) made possible by constructing a debt-based currency (and this looting, unlike fiat looting, does not benefit govt, only the FED), there is also the tricky problem of the exponential function noted above that speaks to the common fallacy that productivity can earn us out of our debt.

    In a nutshell, here’s the problem: The FED must continually inflate the money supply at least enough to allow the servicing of current debt–otherwise catastrophic default occurs since there is only enough money in existence at any one time to equal the principal of the debt, and no legal means to pay the interest due above that principal. Thus, interest can only be paid (in the aggregate) by inflating the money supply.

    Hence, we get the common fallacy that if productivity is higher than this “rent” being charged on our money, then we can pay off the debt. Yet notice, this “rent” call it the Fed Funds Rate or whatever metric you prefer applies to the aggregate debt as a proportional increase over a given term. THAT, mon ami, is what is known in mathematical circles as an exponential function. And that means from the very start, there is no way to avoid both principal and interest from rising to infinity, and rather quickly, even with very small interest rates.

    The fallacy is that while exponential functions are quite cozy in math and theory, they do not and cannot exist in the natural world indefinitely. For example, population growth is modeled with an exponential function, but no one seriously believes population can grow to infinity because, unlike in an equation, real people bump up against real, physical limitations, such as scarce resources, plague, war–whatever. For the same reasons, to assume that productivity can grow exponentially over an infinite period is likewise absurd. Yet, that is what must be assumed if one is to believe that productivity can outpace the new debt–because the new debt is and must be an exponential function, as it has no physical limits other than pushing buttons and adding zeros.

    Besides, how do people, even very productive people, ever pay off debt with money that cannot exist but for debt. As long as the Fed exists (or at least maintains a monopoly on our money) it is impossible to extinguish govt debt by any means. In fact, it is impossible for debt not to grow exponentially unless we presume periodic, widespread catastrophic defaults, in which case, the money itself is not exactly operating as the FED promised our hapless Congress 100 years ago. Default is the only available option, and that by itself is still not enough. It must also be accompanied by termination of the debt-based scheme of money.

  • Amyrlyn

    Hi Duke1632. That was a very clear and completely accurate description of an exponential function that you delivered in your post. Do you teach mathematics? If not, you should.

  • sbozich

    Sure, but even if we transitioned to a non-debt-based currency, fiat or
    otherwise, we would still be saddled with debt, unless – like you point out
    - we default, we produce our way out of it (or produce the same amount and
    consume less through austerity measures, be they voluntary or forced), or
    split the baby by devaluing the currency. I’m going to take the liberty of
    divining the spirit of J.S. Mill, and suggest that the utility of spreading
    out the pain of repaying the debt over several generations is greater than
    placing the cost of default on the next one alone. Indeed, the lingering
    effects of the default may very well surpass the time it takes to retire it.
    Of course this is entirely speculative; nonetheless it is possible, and
    thus should not be discounted.
    I’d like to touch base with you on some things off this board. Is there a
    way I can get a hold of you?

  • Duke1632

    In that case (once debt-based currency is terminated), then I must agree there would at least be a claim that somebody (be it the entity of govt, or by proxy, the people) owes somebody else.  In order to satisfy that claim by conventional means, I think the 3 items you listed would be the most common.  To those, I would add another 3: (1) selling off public (i.e., govt) assets; (2) voluntary forgiveness of the debt by a creditor; or (3) some combination of the previous 2 and/or your 3, possibly in the form of debt-restructuring.  If you’d like to contact me, shoot me an email at ____.  That’s my junk email I never check, but if I know to expect something, I’ll look for you.

  • Nicholas Wind

    Bang on Fred! 

  • Ira Thurby-Wright

     “before President Richard Nixon embarked upon an experiment to end the practice in the 1970s”

    But I don’t think Forbes gets it. I think little of Nixon (“Crook-in-Chief”), but to say that it was his decision to break with Bretton Woods ignores the fact that his predecessor (LBJ) engaged in an undeclared and unfunded war (which Nixon chose to continue to prosecute), and the French, who’s sorry asses the US went to Indo-China to bail out had begun redeeming in mass SDR certificates to empty the US Treasury of its Gold. This lack of understanding of history impugns the credibility of his forecast, which already sorely underestimates the interest of the Fed Reserve System (“da banksters”) in an unbacked currency and the extents to which they’ll protect those interests (e.g. Lincoln, McKinley, Kennedy, and almost Reagan and Jackson).

  • Naomi9093

    That’s exactly what would happen pal.  And it’s the same thing they are doing now, just grind up the ole presses and turn em out.  This is not a bad thing though, IF it is controlled by matching the amount of currency with the amount of wealth that is actually in the economy.  And though it would take smarter people than me (and maybe you) to figure it out, it can be and has been done,  like a stock that is valued at the actual amount that the company is worth.  Competing currencies?  Just how would currencies compete?  Like in the 1800′s where each bank had it’s own note?  Could you or I print up our own currency?  The when these currencies are presented, don’t they have to be honored?  Is that not a form of a “debt-based” systems, of which all currency exchange systems invariably are?  The gold standard is flawed, simply because there is a finite amount of gold, while economic growth, expanding wealth is infinite.  We must have an infinite source of instruments to reflect that wealth Duke, and gold just aint gonna do it.  I just think that what you are proposing is a scaling down of the economy, which is looking back, when we must look forward and “scale up” the economy to the point that we can afford the things that we need to sustain it.  The projects, challenges, aspirations and endeavors of our future cannot be attained using today’s and especially yesterdays economic models.

    As for the looting, the businesses are just doing what they do and are getting what they paid for – politicians, who, on both sides of the isle, work for business.  So of course they are gonna look out for the interest of those who sent them.  How would you feel if you hired a guy to cut your grass, and he cut your neighbors.  Well, we have exactly the same thing here.  We didn’t  hire those politicians, business did.  Businesses pay for those television adds and election campaigns… And that’s who they serve and the is the way it will be as long as politicians are allowed to accept money from businesses.  We would be much better off as a country if we just said, hey you, garbage man or CEO, can vote, contribute as a private citizen, but not as a business or a lobbyist.    Businesses and lobbyist are running this country.  What was suppose to be a government of the people, by the people and for the people has become a government of business,  by the business and for the business…  And this is running us by shorting our national interest for the global good – the global business good.  Case in point is that most of the money in the financial bailout went to foreign banks, so the political processes in the United States, especially the republicans, are pursuing an agenda where as the American people are expendable.  Case in point;  Just look at the way that they fought tooth and nail against regulation of the financial industry, the same financial industry that tried to drive us off a cliff with insane schemes to derive profits not from goods and services, but from derivatives and “swaps”, that serve no social purpose or benefit, and as we all found out, end up sucking our treasury dry.  They fight just as hard against any initiative to protect the PEOPLE from business excesses and the democrats are no Angles here and are the another act in the very same show.  They finally watered the bill down to something akin to a wet noodle that does absolutely nothing and has set us up for even greater economic calamities, because the very same people who steered us into that mess basically wrote the bill and are even more entrenched, when they should have been booted onto welfare. 

    Capitalism should be unfettered, because we need the imagination, ingenuity and thirst of capitalism to power our economy, but this mixing of government and business is dangerous for all, ESPECIALLY capitalism, because a few more upheavals like 2008 will result in capitalism being taken out the equation, because eventually all governments are of the people, by the people and for the people and answerable to the people and people have a very short fuse for bailing out millionaires and billionaires, especially at their expense, and especially when they are being thrown out in the street.  Government need to be allowed to do what it does and capitalism should be allowed to do as it does.  Governments can’t be businesses and should not try to act like one and business should not and under normal circumstances cannot operate like a business.  Have a good weekend!

  • Jack J. Smith

    Nixon did it because the Arab oil money was sucking all the gold out of our country. Can you imagine if china calls in the gold on our currency?